Coronavirus

[George]

I think a real missed opportunity is at the beginning of the pandemic, I really thought there would be more creative ways of continuing some semblance of normalcy but in a safer, COVID-aware way. Instead, we've ended up with a sizable segment of the population who wants to ignore it and do everything they used to do, the way they used to do it, and it stifles the ability to change our communal mindset to something that would reward (or make profitable) innovation in safe socializing.

I agree with you. But I wonder if it’s even possible for the people of this country to have gotten on board early on, without having had the experience of mass infections and deaths (early on, it was widely believed by those who believe things like Hillary operated a sex ring out of the basement of a Pizza shop, that the virus was just a “New York“ thing that couldn’t possibly migrate to other areas. There’s so much willingness to distrust any authority that unifying early on against something we’ve never seen in our lifetimes (never mind it was already happening in Europe) was bound to turn into a “watch me” scenario.

 

[moscow]

In my free time I have friends telling me about in-home painting parties, cake decorating parties, eating out, travel plans, and going to infant swim lessons. They tell me they are "over it" and ask me "Is it really that bad? Isn't it just that we're testing more than the spring?" I wish I could be "over it". Their personal experience is so very different from mine. It's become a widening gulf.

My daughter got a call from one of her high school coaches asking if she would consider "going out" for the basketball team (under a home school student exception) because they need 1 more player to complete the team for this year. Now, my daughter is going to school on-line, is a cancer survivor, and we have not left our house since March because she is very high risk, but this coach felt no compunction about calling her to ask her to go out for the basketball team. I cannot believe that: 1) they are even considering having a basketball team during the middle of a pandemic and I cannot even contemplate the danger that they are placing these children in; 2) they would ask a high risk person to consider going out for the team; and 3) he was shocked at the response he got from my husband (which I will NOT repeat here! LOL!). I cannot figure out what in the world is going through the minds of these people right now!

 

[bnoble]

just read a story about how few states have taken advantage of Google and Apple basically building contact tracing apps (all the states need to do is enter a tiny bit of configuration information).

A former student who was involved in this effort told me that getting the platform hooked into a State's infrastructure is harder than it sounds, because each state's regulatory framework and systems are different. (The joys of federalism!) It's a lot of work. Some states aren't willing to do it, but others are not yet able.

There's also the problem that the platform is opt-in, and even a modest %age of those not opting in means you still have to do more or less full contact tracing for every case. Plus, not everyone has a smartphone.

 

[bnoble]

I wonder if it’s even possible for the people of this country to have gotten on board early on, without having had the experience of mass infections and deaths

Maybe not. One reason Pacific Rim countries are doing better may be at least in part because they actually learned the lesson with SARS, where we didn't have to. There's a reason that you'd see a non-trivial number of people wearing masks in e.g. the Shanghai metro even without anything more serious than flu circulating.

This might be one of those things that you have to learn the hard way.

 

[Art Vandelay]

It seems like for a significant percentage of the population, it doesn't really exist, except *maybe* when it affects them personally (Chris Christie, or my previously-mask-denier colleague whose healthy friend fell off his mountain bike, broke his collarbone, went to the ER, caught COVID there and died). What a tragedy.

I just can't wrap my head around this. How many more "he wouldn't wear a mask, didn't believe it was real until he caught it and died" news stories need to be seen before it sinks in??

 

[Art Vandelay]

Maybe not. One reason Pacific Rim countries are doing better may be at least in part because they actually learned the lesson with SARS, where we didn't have to. There's a reason that you'd see a non-trivial number of people wearing masks in e.g. the Shanghai metro even without anything more serious than flu circulating.

This might be one of those things that you have to learn the hard way.

If only the WH had some kind of guidelines, or playbook, to help them with how to manage the pandemic...

 

[DopeyRunr]

A former student who was involved in this effort told me that getting the platform hooked into a State's infrastructure is harder than it sounds, because each state's regulatory framework and systems are different. (The joys of federalism!) It's a lot of work. Some states aren't willing to do it, but others are not yet able.

There's also the problem that the platform is opt-in, and even a modest %age of those not opting in means you still have to do more or less full contact tracing for every case. Plus, not everyone has a smartphone.

It's a lot of work, and it's not perfect. Neither are reasons not to do it.

 

[lovett1979]

That said, when you have a group of people who are on board with reality, you can come up with a way to have a meaningful gathering that is also safe. My church choir has been meeting on Zoom since March, and our church (based on denominational guidance) planned early on that it wouldn't open to in-person services and events until at least May 2021. But following the science, it was recently decided that outdoor, masked groups of 10 or less could meet on our grounds, and so now we have a hybrid choir experience. It was so nice to sing with my community! These are the things that make me hopeful.

I'm glad you are figuring out how to do what you love safely. I just wanted to recommend the Resonance mask for singing (https://www.mymusicfolders.com/product/resonance-singers-mask-with-disposable-biofilters/). I'm a professional singer and have tried singing in a number of different types of mask (including ones specifically made for singing). I found this one to be the most comfortable and most safe option. (I am not a paid spokesperson or anything, I'm just happy I found something that works and want to share that information)

 

[Strangeite]

(The joys of federalism!)

I have commented several times that Covid has been the strongest argument for Federalism since the Federalist Papers.

 

[smwisc]

I remember someone (Fauci maybe? or Cuomo?) saying in early spring that if you're doing things right, it will look like you overreacted. Because if you wait to enact the public health and safety measures until it *seems* like you really need them, by then it will be too late. That's what it looks like with communities who can't effectively contact trace, who can't turnaround test results in 24-48 hours (or less) because the systems are overwhelmed. The right approach is to okay with being mocked for having an unneeded 1,500 bed hospital ship docked in the harbor, rather than seeing hundreds or thousands of patients left to die because hospitals are at full capacity. But most politicians aren't okay with the risk of looking foolish.

I just read a story about how few states have taken advantage of Google and Apple basically building contact tracing apps (all the states need to do is enter a tiny bit of configuration information). It may have been a conscious choice not to build it a few months ago, but now those states probably don't have the personnel to implement the system because they're just trying to keep their head above water.

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Yes, and in some areas we have politicians who did try, and were shot down by the opposition and/or the courts - which (among other problems) degrades the public dialogue to a point that I don't know if it can be recovered.

 

[bnoble]

It's a lot of work, and it's not perfect. Neither are reasons not to do it.

The question is whether or not it actually saves tracing time, and is that saved time worth the effort getting it to happen---because the latter costs money and people too.

As I understand it, the answer is "maybe."

 

[Anne]

Nia, here is a research article on long COVID.

NIHR Evidence - Living with Covid19 - Informative and accessible health and care research

evidence.nihr.ac.uk

 

[Mrs Darling]

The question is whether or not it actually saves tracing time, and is that saved time worth the effort getting it to happen---because the latter costs money and people too.

As I understand it, the answer is "maybe."

We’ve had an app for a while now but are only getting modest uptake (and I’m disappointed it’s not being pushed harder.) DH led a team working on the integration and the way it works here, it isn’t that big a job to implement & the privacy is good. It certainly isn’t meant to replace contact tracing. It’s meant to supplement it, to pick up more of the casual contacts that might go untraced (in front of somebody in a queue, or shopping near someone in a grocery store. ) It would also come in handy if it did get out of control & the contact tracers couldn’t keep up. Just one more tool in the toolkit.

 

[DopeyRunr]

All that time tracking dot com stocks in 1999/2000 prepared me for tracking ND coronavirus cases in 2020.

 

[geek1997]

I’m so sorry this is your situation. Is this for second semester or is the transition immediate? I don’t think it’s fair at all to make your daughter drop her AP class! Our school district isn’t offering every class virtually and my kids had to adjust some of their classes, but it was prior to the start of the school year. I would push back since her AP class is most likely a year long class, some school districts here are paying the tuition for an online school for classes that aren’t offered. Maybe they could do that for your daughter?

We were originally told that selections would apply for the entire 'semester' (two grading periods). There must have been significant pushback because a couple of weeks later they announced that elections would only apply for the first grading period. Waiting to see what happens after the next grading period. For now, we're thankful that her electives have been doing the best they can integrating the in-person and virtual students (dance and band).

Survival of the adaptable-ist, I guess.

 

[Art Vandelay]

All that time tracking dot com stocks in 1999/2000 prepared me for tracking ND coronavirus cases in 2020.

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Seven ICU beds available statewide. This is dangerous, not only for COVID patients needing ICU but for non-COVID as well. And I'd bet there are many in ND (and SD) who still think "it's just sniffles."

We are all inter-connected, like it or not, with regard to controlling the spread. What we, as individuals, choose to do, or not do, with regard to the CDC guidelines, can, with a few degrees of separation, affect people in other states in a matter of days/weeks.

It comes down to empathy. Put the welfare of others before your (the public you, not anyone here) desire to make a stand on your "rights", the Constitution, whatever.

 

[geek1997]

A former student who was involved in this effort told me that getting the platform hooked into a State's infrastructure is harder than it sounds, because each state's regulatory framework and systems are different. (The joys of federalism!) It's a lot of work. Some states aren't willing to do it, but others are not yet able.

There's also the problem that the platform is opt-in, and even a modest %age of those not opting in means you still have to do more or less full contact tracing for every case. Plus, not everyone has a smartphone.

The Bluetooth coding system is built in to the iOS (there's an option to turn it on) but it doesn't do anything if the state does not have an app? I've been wondering what the disconnect is.

 

[Mrs Darling]

The Bluetooth coding system is built in to the iOS (there's an option to turn it on) but it doesn't do anything if the state does not have an app? I've been wondering what the disconnect is.

Yes (both IoS & Android ) you have to have Bluetooth turned on & notifications from the app turned on. Both Google & Apple supply the base code, then, the way its been implemented in Canada, there was some work to do on the interface, branding etc., and a database (that was at the federal level here but it wouldn't have to be- seemed to be about a team of 8ish for 6 weeks including testing) training of staff, public communications etc. Then deployment to the app stores.

When you test positive, you're given a one-time code to enter by public health. The app then flags your non-identifiable "token" in the system as positive. For the rest of the users, the app periodically checks to see if any of the tokens you've collected from other people while out moving around in the world, have been marked as positive. If 1 has, you get a pop-up message telling you to self-isolate & make arrangements to get tested.
There are some other (possibly better from a public health standpoint) approaches that have been used in other countries, but this is the highest privacy of the models that were evaluated. They decided that was most important factor if they wanted people to adopt it.

 

[Strangeite]

... seemed to be about a team of 8ish for 6 weeks including testing)

I believe this. A good friend of mine, up until recently, was on the team that developed and maintained the software that the House of Representatives used to draft legislation. It is this software that basically indexes everything in a piece of legislation with what it impacts in the Federal Register and vice versa. As you can imagine this is a pretty important piece of software. His team had about 7 people on it.

 

[Nia]

We have the app here. As anything the trouble comes that those who break the rules don't want it but it is still helpful. It is only viewed as supplement to contact tracing